Low body Temp

[mikeyboyeee]

So I recently started taking my body temp and it varies between 96.2 and 98.2
Almost always 97.3 and under.

I am on 100mg cyp week, 250iu hcg eod and 50mcg T3 divided into 4 doses.

What is this low temp signaling? Hypothyorid-even with 50mcg T3?

Adrenal fatigue?

[gman]

even my new doc, who is very open to things, cautioned me against using body temp to diagnose hypo.

Normal body temps of 98.6 are the average, and it is a bell curve, meaning some people walk around higher, and some lower, and it's perfectly normal.

[simpllyhuge]

How much lower? Is the general consensus? I wonder how it correlates to those who feel great, like random people who are wouldn't be on these boards and are always in shape, I wonder what their temp would be.

[JanSz]

So I recently started taking my body temp and it varies between 96.2 and 98.2
Almost always 97.3 and under.

I am on 100mg cyp week, 250iu hcg eod and 50mcg T3 divided into 4 doses.

What is this low temp signaling? Hypothyorid-even with 50mcg T3?

Adrenal fatigue?

August 12 2009
age 37, 5'6", 255#, waist 44"

Are you eating recommended supplements? (spreadsheet)

In your description I do not see:
Cortef 5mg pills, take 4x/day as follows, 10mg/wakeup, 10mg/4hrs latter, 5mg/4hrs latter, 5mg/4hrs latter

are you doing it?

I see that you are still on old T3 dose.
Nov24/09 --T3-75mcg/day

Why?
=================================================
Anything happened to:
01/12/2010

Ask dr for SpectraCell-5000 test
with all bells and whistless, check all boxes.

It would be a good idea to add to that

Fatty Acid analysis from Genova.

and be over with tests for little bit.

-----------------------------

Are you eating any carbohydrates?

70% Fat
3% carbohydrates
27% proteins

3% means that you are getting them only by mistake not on the purpose.
-----------------------------------------

...
36.80 98.24 dr Mariano's max acceptable
36.75 98.15
36.70 98.06
36.65 97.97
36.60 97.88 ------------ideal
36.55 97.79
36.50 97.70
36.45 97.61
36.40 97.52
36.35 97.43
36.30 97.34 always below this, yest that would be low
36.25 97.25 ------------dr Mariano's minimum acceptable
36.20 97.16
36.15 97.07
36.10 96.98
36.05 96.89
36.00 96.80
35.95 96.71
35.90 96.62
35.85 96.53
35.80 96.44
35.75 96.35
35.70 96.26
35.65 96.17

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mikey;
when you look at supplements recommended in a spreadsheet, they are only the very basic.
I did not want to shoot blindly and make long list of stuff that you may not need.
Getting Spectracell and fatty acids tests is very important,
they will tell you more precisely what you missing.

........
..
Take care Mikey;

..

[crazycrew]

When I first started checking my temps I would have 95.7 rising to between 96.8 and 97.2 during the day. When I started Westroid my temp rose to 98.6 (were it had been all my life) and I felt normal again. (for a good while anyway)

[pmgamer18]

Well people and Dr.'s can say what they want I used my Temps to tell when my Adrenals were supported on enough Cortef HC. and to tell how my Armour was doing to treat my Thyroid. Here is a link to the site and chart I used and this works great at least it did for me.
http://www.drrind.com/therapies/metabolic-temperature-graph

Before labs Dr. did this to tell if your thyroid was low and went by how you feel.
http://drbate.com/Ref/thyroid.html

I can't tell you how many people posted on the forums that there Dr. told them there Thyroid was fine and all they tested was there TSH. When they told the good Dr. how bad they feel he would then go into this bull about them being Depressed and offer Prozac WTF give me a break.
Here is a long list of how people feel with a low Thyroid.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/long-and-pathetic/

How much lower? Is the general consensus? I wonder how it correlates to those who feel great, like random people who are wouldn't be on these boards and are always in shape, I wonder what their temp would be.

[JanSz]

When I first started checking my temps I would have 95.7 rising to between 96.8 and 97.2 during the day. When I started Westroid my temp rose to 98.6 (were it had been all my life) and I felt normal again. (for a good while anyway)

37.00 ----- 98.60

That would be a little high where I am coming from.
My Mom would suspect in-coming cold if I had that temp.


.....

[mikeyboyeee]

My temps had historically been 98.6 when younger.


I am not on cortef yet and only on 50mcg of T3 becuase I have no tbeen back to Dr. yet.
Going tomorrow to get 75mcg T3 script and 30mg cortef /day script.

Oh, I am down to 245 now with 40" waist since then.

[JanSz]

My temps had historically been 98.6 when younger.


I am not on cortef yet and only on 50mcg of T3 becuase I have no tbeen back to Dr. yet.
Going tomorrow to get 75mcg T3 script and 30mg cortef /day script.

Oh, I am down to 245 now with 40" waist since then.

Well, we may or may not have a problem here.

I suggest that
you do not go to 75mcg-T3 until after you are on 30mg/day Cortef for at least a week.

Also start slowly when introducing Cortef.

Take a week to ramp up from 5mg to 30mg Cortef

Monitor temps, pulse and blood pressure, take longer than a week it you have any doubts.

Stop T3 for a day or two if you would get thyroid dump, but then you have to resume T3 at 1/2 of previous dose, then work on building up again.

One thing, very important when using T3, you cannot abruptly end using it, so make sure that you do not run out of T3.

......

[LowT]

Are you guys talking about basal temps or afternoon temps?

I've read ideal basal (taking temp first moment of waking without leaving bed) is between 97.8-98.2 and afternoon temps should not be above 98.6

[pmgamer18]

There are 3 ways to do temps to tell if you need Thyroid meds do your basal temps in the morning under your arm for 10 min's before getting out of bed or even moving much. Then you can take your temps after your up 3 hrs 3x's a day every 3 hrs. Then you add them up and Div. by 3 this is your avg. if your avg goes up or down 2ths your adrenals are not supported on HC yet some times it can take more then 20 mgs a day and it can take 30 days to get supported once your supported then you can add Thyroid meds like Armour. Now when on Armour type meds after you start you will see your temp go up your avg. that is. most with bad Adrenals will start low like 45 mgs of Armour your temp avg. will go up then in about 2 weeks fall again this is when you can add more Armour but only 15 mgs then your temp will go up again. I ended up adding 15 mgs until I was up to 90 mgs then after this I held this dose for 8 weeks did labs seen how they looked and how I felt and would go up 15mgs more then hold again for 8 more weeks.
http://forums.realthyroidhelp.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=24

Are you guys talking about basal temps or afternoon temps?

I've read ideal basal (taking temp first moment of waking without leaving bed) is between 97.8-98.2 and afternoon temps should not be above 98.6

[chilln]

So I recently started taking my body temp and it varies between 96.2 and 98.2
Almost always 97.3 and under.

I am on 100mg cyp week, 250iu hcg eod and 50mcg T3 divided into 4 doses.

What is this low temp signaling? Hypothyorid-even with 50mcg T3?

Adrenal fatigue?

Could be either. Sometimes a boost in cortisol allows natural thyroid hormone levels to shine. Other times a boost in thyroid hormone T3 (usually with some T4) is required because a person's thyroid glands are gentically limited (usually due to aging, not a birth defect)

Sometimes a boost in cortisol can come from a boost in testosterone, or GH (when GH improves deep sleep quality).

It's actually difficult to tell from labs and symptoms which route to follow, and the usual labs and symptoms need to be accompanied by therapeutic testing (a dosage response trial) of both avenues to determine how your genetics are behaving (misbehaving).

There are even more options and pitfalls than I've mentioned here, but these ones which pop up most often.

Symptoms analysis is good. We're going to need more labs, as well as the results of any past therapeutic testing (dosage response trials) to see if there's a clue there as to which route to follow.

.

[PPC]

37.00 ----- 98.60

That would be a little high where I am coming from.
My Mom would suspect in-coming cold if I had that temp.


.....

Jansz, it seems those temp numbers that you posted as suggested optimum by Dr Mariano are lower than what most of the other thyroid gurus are having us all shoot for. My basal temps taken with a geratherm (non digital) thermometer under the arm for ten minutes have been from ranging from 97.1 to 97.5 during the last 5 days. My temps seldom get into the 98's during the day and if so, never past 98.1.

If I felt fine that would be okay but I am cold most of the time and have episodes where I just can't warm up. Yesterday, I checked my basal temp and then tested four of my children the same way - arm pit. Mine was 97.1, two of my children had just woken up and had 98.2 already. The other two had been up for a while and were already at 98.4. My children are very healthy and run around the house bare foot, with no need for long sleves while I wear thermal socks and sweaters. I notice they don't have to have their feet covered while they sleep and don't wake up cold if their blankets fall off at night. So....seems to me healthy humans do tend to easily be in the 98's.

Do you not feel cold below 98.6? I am surprised you are not up there atleast in the afternooon with the 75 mg t3 that you eat and your adrenals nicely optimised by medrol.

Right now, I am working on my low ferritin with liver supps etc and once that is up, I'll start labbing my thyroid numbers and see if further work is needed.

My husband told me he was 98.6 all his life until recently. Now he is cold and lower - I'm sure the thyroid just gives out a little with age.

[JackBauer]

I wonder how accurate this is...

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/13600/13600-h/images/02_01_4.png

Even on Cytomel 50mcg total per day, and 1 grain of NatureThroid, I rarely hit 98.6. Normal high for me during the day - on a digital oral thermometer... Is around 98.4.

[era]

So I recently started taking my body temp and it varies between 96.2 and 98.2
Almost always 97.3 and under.

I am on 100mg cyp week, 250iu hcg eod and 50mcg T3 divided into 4 doses.

What is this low temp signaling? Hypothyorid-even with 50mcg T3?

Adrenal fatigue?

A temp as low as 96.2F is a bad sign. I know because I used to be there myself.

Have you taken at least a morning cortisol reading from blood? Or better yet, a 4-sample cortisol saliva test (e.g. from canaryclub/ZRT)? If your cortisol is varying widely or is too low, your thyroid dose won't be effective.

How fast did you raise to 50mcg T3? Getting there too fast can stress the adrenals.

How do you know you're on the right dose of T3? If you haven't measured FT3, you can't know unless you've been on T3 a long time at various doses so you have some experience. At your lowest thyroid point (just before your next dose), you are going to be hypothyroid if your T3 is less than ~6 pg/ml. You will need an FT3 higher than a "normal" person running on the T3+T4 from their own thyroid.

Other than your temp, don't you just feel plain bad? You didn't describe symptoms. Usually someone with cortisol deficiency will feel pretty out of sorts. How is sleep quality? If is likely to be poor if you are hypothyroid.

[era]

I wonder how accurate this is...

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/13600/13600-h/images/02_01_4.png

Even on Cytomel 50mcg total per day, and 1 grain of NatureThroid, I rarely hit 98.6. Normal high for me during the day - on a digital oral thermometer... Is around 98.4.

Digital oral thermometers are notoriously inaccurate. I got really burned by one. It's really best to use a good-quality column thermometer - typically they're German-made.

[JanSz]

Jansz, it seems those temp numbers that you posted as suggested optimum by Dr Mariano are lower than what most of the other thyroid gurus are having us all shoot for. My basal temps taken with a geratherm (non digital) thermometer under the arm for ten minutes have been from ranging from 97.1 to 97.5 during the last 5 days. My temps seldom get into the 98's during the day and if so, never past 98.1.

If I felt fine that would be okay but I am cold most of the time and have episodes where I just can't warm up. Yesterday, I checked my basal temp and then tested four of my children the same way - arm pit. Mine was 97.1, two of my children had just woken up and had 98.2 already. The other two had been up for a while and were already at 98.4. My children are very healthy and run around the house bare foot, with no need for long sleves while I wear thermal socks and sweaters. I notice they don't have to have their feet covered while they sleep and don't wake up cold if their blankets fall off at night. So....seems to me healthy humans do tend to easily be in the 98's.

Do you not feel cold below 98.6? I am surprised you are not up there atleast in the afternooon with the 75 mg t3 that you eat and your adrenals nicely optimised by medrol.

Right now, I am working on my low ferritin with liver supps etc and once that is up, I'll start labbing my thyroid numbers and see if further work is needed.

My husband told me he was 98.6 all his life until recently. Now he is cold and lower - I'm sure the thyroid just gives out a little with age.

I cannot say if I was the healthiest child, but when my mom was taking care of me, absent time of colds, every time I checked I had 36.6C=97.88F.

Lets add some wiggle room

36.8C=98.24F
36.6C=97.88F
36.4C=07.52F

That was with mercury thermometer under armpit.
================================================== =======

I think, mostly, body temp depends on (cortisol-T3) levels at given time.

Feeling warm or cold does not correspond to actual body temperature.
One may feel hot and have relatively low body temp.

I touch lots of different women while dancing.
Close to half feel cold to my touch (but the still smile at me (warmly).

...
http://www.definitivemind.com/forums/showpost.php?p=459&postcount=4

Dr Mariano
Generally, I would be pretty happy if the temperature is over 97.2 degrees and below 98.2 degrees.

===========================================

..

[user785]

For what it's worth - my temp as taken by oral thermometer OR in-ear digital one ranges from 93 early AM to 94 afternoon. I must be one of those on the fringes of the bell curve...

[JackBauer]

For what it's worth - my temp as taken by oral thermometer OR in-ear digital one ranges from 93 early AM to 94 afternoon. I must be one of those on the fringes of the bell curve...

I found one of those ear thermometers to vary incredibly from reading to reading...

I remember seeing a web page by a leading thyroid physician recommending a specific glass thermometer hand made somewhere in Europe. It was flat, so it didn't roll... And I think non mercury too.

For the life of me I can't find that web page...

[PPC]

I cannot say if I was the healthiest child, but when my mom was taking care of me, absent time of colds, every time I checked I had 36.6C=97.88F.

Lets add some wiggle room

36.8C=98.24F
36.6C=97.88F
36.4C=07.52F

That was with mercury thermometer under armpit.
================================================== =======

I think, mostly, body temp depends on (cortisol-T3) levels at given time.

Feeling warm or cold does not correspond to actual body temperature.
One may feel hot and have relatively low body temp.

I touch lots of different women while dancing.
Close to half feel cold to my touch (but the still smile at me (warmly).

...
http://www.definitivemind.com/forums/showpost.php?p=459&postcount=4

Dr Mariano
Generally, I would be pretty happy if the temperature is over 97.2 degrees and below 98.2 degrees.

===========================================

..

Thanks for the link. I can see how temps are not just about thyroid. Still, I don't know why Dr Mariano wouldn't like to see someone over 98.2, but I guess he means basal and that might make more sense.

You are touching a lot of women that are cold and smiling but I am betting a lot of them have undiagnosed hypo issues or undertreated thyroids and untreated adrenals, or maybe even just low ferritin issues like myself. Normal doesn't mean optimal. I wonder how your would feel if you had higher temps since you've always been lower since childhood and whether this would cause other hyper symptoms. Have you ever tried to raise your thyroid dose carefully to achieve slightly higher temps just for the heck of it? I know you are more of a lab numers guy but I have read where a lot of people feel best with their free t at 5 or even 6 with temps at 98.6 I'm sure we all have slightly different temps from birth but I wonder if those who have temps more in the 98's have all over better health somehow. Obviously slightly lower temps do not cause weight issues with you.

I had a doctor tell me a couple of nights ago that I have low temps and low ferritin just becaue I am a thin person so why mess with it? If your hematocrit and hemoglobin are in range why worry? But I am going to mess with it. I want to feel and see some 98's for sure and I'll tell you how I feel after I've been on this new path for a while. I wonder what 2 dropperfuls of iodine a week will do along with some of the other things you suggested for my friend. I am going to try them for myself.

People always tell me I feel cold. I was not always this way but I think low ferritin and other sex hormonal imbalances can mess up a well working thyroid/adrenal gland. Or is it the chiken and the egg thingy?

I'm so long winded, no wonder most men want to keep this forum to themselves where most of you are short and concise.:biggrin:

[JanSz]

Thanks for the link. I can see how temps are not just about thyroid. Still, I don't know why Dr Mariano wouldn't like to see someone over 98.2, but I guess he means basal and that might make more sense.

You are touching a lot of women that are cold and smiling but I am betting a lot of them have undiagnosed hypo issues or undertreated thyroids and untreated adrenals, or maybe even just low ferritin issues like myself. Normal doesn't mean optimal. I wonder how your would feel if you had higher temps since you've always been lower since childhood and whether this would cause other hyper symptoms. Have you ever tried to raise your thyroid dose carefully to achieve slightly higher temps just for the heck of it? I know you are more of a lab numers guy but I have read where a lot of people feel best with their free t at 5 or even 6 with temps at 98.6 I'm sure we all have slightly different temps from birth but I wonder if those who have temps more in the 98's have all over better health somehow. Obviously slightly lower temps do not cause weight issues with you.

I had a doctor tell me a couple of nights ago that I have low temps and low ferritin just becaue I am a thin person so why mess with it? If your hematocrit and hemoglobin are in range why worry? But I am going to mess with it. I want to feel and see some 98's for sure and I'll tell you how I feel after I've been on this new path for a while. I wonder what 2 dropperfuls of iodine a week will do along with some of the other things you suggested for my friend. I am going to try them for myself.

People always tell me I feel cold. I was not always this way but I think low ferritin and other sex hormonal imbalances can mess up a well working thyroid/adrenal gland. Or is it the chiken and the egg thingy?

I'm so long winded, no wonder most men want to keep this forum to themselves where most of you are short and concise.:biggrin:

low ferritin---->> eat liver and/or UNI-LIVER

I hope my adrenals are properly supported.
About a moth and half ago I got results of my Spectracell-5000.
Few minor tweaks, I think that I have all the adrenal and thyroid support that I need.

In first week of Sep/10 I went on 50mcg-T3, by end of Sep I was switched to 75mcg-T3

I am not going to make any adjustments now.
Next Tuesday I will draw blood, within 3 weeks or so I should have results.
Will revisit all my medicines and supplements dosing with test results in hand.

Going by how I feel, I think I will go for 100mcg-T3.

Some of my daily temp variations are (obviously) due to my once a day T3 dosing.

I do not feel any problems due to that but it is convenience issue.
But I may change that for a while just so I can see what happen.

-------

[simpllyhuge]

I appreciate the long post, It keeps me from repeating the question.

[PPC]

I found one of those ear thermometers to vary incredibly from reading to reading...

I remember seeing a web page by a leading thyroid physician recommending a specific glass thermometer hand made somewhere in Europe. It was flat, so it didn't roll... And I think non mercury too.

For the life of me I can't find that web page...

Geratherm is made in Europe and is the most reccomended. Real cheap, about $5 at WalMart but higher online actually. I broke mine today shaking it down so I see why the mercruy ones were taken off the market. Silver looking stuff everywhere. It says atleast 3 m but you really need ten minutes under the arm or 5-8 orally. I only do under the arm now.

[PPC]

For what it's worth - my temp as taken by oral thermometer OR in-ear digital one ranges from 93 early AM to 94 afternoon. I must be one of those on the fringes of the bell curve...

Wow! Looooooow, so low! Do you have any thyroid labs that correlate?

[PPC]

I wonder how accurate this is...

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/13600/13600-h/images/02_01_4.png

Even on Cytomel 50mcg total per day, and 1 grain of NatureThroid, I rarely hit 98.6. Normal high for me during the day - on a digital oral thermometer... Is around 98.4.


I've been hanging out at a lot of the thyroid forums that advocate dessicated pig thyroid or t3 over synthroid, trying to read and digest. Most of them agree that people usually need between three and five grains to feel good or mostly >5o mcg t3 but your 98.4 is pretty darn close to their suggested temp optimum. Do you feel great on the cytomel and the one grain of Nature Thyroid or not?

[JackBauer]

I've been hanging out at a lot of the thyroid forums that advocate dessicated pig thyroid or t3 over synthroid, trying to read and digest. Most of them agree that people usually need between three and five grains to feel good or mostly >5o mcg t3 but your 98.4 is pretty darn close to their suggested temp optimum. Do you feel great on the cytomel and the one grain of Nature Thyroid or not?

That was peak, during the day.

As opposed to that graph which has people well into the 99's. And I don't hit 98.4 that often. Although my thermometer just told me 98.4, at 10:30PM at night. (The reading just before that was 97.6 though)

Just moving it half an inch forward, as opposed to under the rear half of the tongue where it is thicker, seems to make a bit of a difference.

I wake up at 96.x all the time...

[JackBauer]

I found it....

http://www.wilsonsthyroidsyndrome.com/Products/Thermometer.htm

[PPC]

I found it....

http://www.wilsonsthyroidsyndrome.com/Products/Thermometer.htm


Yes, that is the one I just broke that is $3 cheaper at Walmart. But the consensus is that 3 m is not really enough depite what the advertising says. 10 m under the arm seems to be what people end up doing with it.

[JackBauer]

Yes, that is the one I just broke that is $3 cheaper at Walmart. But the consensus is that 3 m is not really enough depite what the advertising says. 10 m under the arm seems to be what people end up doing with it.

I'm glad everyone recommended going the under-arm route.

Yesterday I did 6 evenly spaced samples - about 3 hours apart...

Starting at 7:30 AM, where I was 97.1 F

Then 98.3, 98.4, 98.5, 98.5, 98.5

It averages out to be 98.2F.

I guess all things considered, this isn't "bad"... But two points...

1) I recall one of the thyroid specialists saying that if you wake up witha temperature below 97.2, you could have a problem. I'm at 97.1, and it's a somewhat late wakeup time, so my temperature at 6:30 AM would have probably been substantially lower.

2) The link showing the 24hr temperatures suggest that peak temps are ~99F. I never even hit 98.6.

I know it's silly to think that everyone MUST be 98.6 to be healthy, and while I feel better than I did when I wasn't taking any thyroid medication - I just wonder if my thyroid problems are over. Symptomatically I still suffer from unacceptable erection quality. Better than it use to be, but I don't know if the thyroid part of it is now fixed or not.

[PPC]

I'm glad everyone recommended going the under-arm route.

Yesterday I did 6 evenly spaced samples - about 3 hours apart...

Starting at 7:30 AM, where I was 97.1 F

Then 98.3, 98.4, 98.5, 98.5, 98.5

It averages out to be 98.2F.

I guess all things considered, this isn't "bad"... But two points...

1) I recall one of the thyroid specialists saying that if you wake up witha temperature below 97.2, you could have a problem. I'm at 97.1, and it's a somewhat late wakeup time, so my temperature at 6:30 AM would have probably been substantially lower.

2) The link showing the 24hr temperatures suggest that peak temps are ~99F. I never even hit 98.6.

I know it's silly to think that everyone MUST be 98.6 to be healthy, and while I feel better than I did when I wasn't taking any thyroid medication - I just wonder if my thyroid problems are over. Symptomatically I still suffer from unacceptable erection quality. Better than it use to be, but I don't know if the thyroid part of it is now fixed or not.

I'm not sure you are supposed to include the basal temp when you are averaging. Just the 3 day temps I think. I get what you are saying that we shouldn't be obsessive about chasing temps. But maybe there is still room for you to increase. I was talking with someone on a thyroid forum who is now finally optimized and feels great. He gave me an example of his temps. Like you, he was lower in basal, but not as low as you. He averaged about 97.6 for that. But during the day, he shot up to between 98.4 - 99.1. But he says he experiences no hyper feelings like that. Overall, he was averaging around 98.6 or slightly above.

Today, I had to take my daughter to the ER because she stood on a nail. There was no fever but her temp came back at 98.7 straight away. Beautiful. In contrast, mine was at 97.7 at the doctor's the other day, some might say, not too bad but I say why not improve if you can? So although I am no expert, I think you've got a little more room to up the dose if there are still some other symptoms. (But of course, they may be due to something else lol.)